Title: The things I see at work
Post by: Thunder Chicken on November 30, 2012, 06:17:06 PM
Post by: Thunder Chicken on November 30, 2012, 06:17:06 PM
Tom is always posting work stories, so I thought I'd post a few recent happenings...
First, my experience with working on the Dodge Caliber/Jeep Patriot/Compass. IN my educated opinion, these are absolutely the worst cars on the road. They are the worst vehicle produced by any manufacturer in the past two decades. Their drivetrains are shiznit (especially the CVT), their suspensions are shiznit (nearly every component needs to be replaced by 36k miles, quite often as low as 10k miles), their interiors and electronics are shiznit, and their bodies are shiznit. Even Fiat/Chrysler's CEO Sergio Marchione has gone on record as saying "To call the Caliber a retail vehicle is an abomination". I shall call these vehicles the "Calicompiat" from here on out.
Now, combine these endearing qualities with the fact that Nova Scotia has one of the most corrosive environments on Earth (this was the results of a study done jointly by GM and Toyota a few decades ago). Vehicles in this environment tend to start showing lots of surface rust on the underside by the time they are five years old. Some trucks (*cough*GM*cough) show some rust-through corrosion on the frame by ten years of age, and most vehicles are rendered unroadworthy by the age of 15. Our junkyards are full of good engines because the vehicles rot away around them.
The Calicompiat is, in addition to all of its mechanical issues, especially rust pr0ne. The rear subframe in particular is especially bad. The metal is only as thick as body sheet metal when new. Once the salt gets to them they deteriorate very quickly. I've had to weld patches into several rear subframes, but this one that came in takes the cake. It came in for a safety inspection, and I was the lucky guy to do the inspection. The car needed the typical (of these cars) rear trailing link bushings, front lower control arms, rear boomerang links, and rear toe links. What took the cake, though, was the rear subframe. It was completely rotted through to the point that it is not salvageable. It must be replaced. This is a 2008 Caliber with 38k miles on it. It's JUST outside of Chrysler's corrosion warranty. The customer is currently arguing with Chrysler Canada over it. Meanwhile the car sits in our compound, unsafe to drive. Pics:
First, my experience with working on the Dodge Caliber/Jeep Patriot/Compass. IN my educated opinion, these are absolutely the worst cars on the road. They are the worst vehicle produced by any manufacturer in the past two decades. Their drivetrains are shiznit (especially the CVT), their suspensions are shiznit (nearly every component needs to be replaced by 36k miles, quite often as low as 10k miles), their interiors and electronics are shiznit, and their bodies are shiznit. Even Fiat/Chrysler's CEO Sergio Marchione has gone on record as saying "To call the Caliber a retail vehicle is an abomination". I shall call these vehicles the "Calicompiat" from here on out.
Now, combine these endearing qualities with the fact that Nova Scotia has one of the most corrosive environments on Earth (this was the results of a study done jointly by GM and Toyota a few decades ago). Vehicles in this environment tend to start showing lots of surface rust on the underside by the time they are five years old. Some trucks (*cough*GM*cough) show some rust-through corrosion on the frame by ten years of age, and most vehicles are rendered unroadworthy by the age of 15. Our junkyards are full of good engines because the vehicles rot away around them.
The Calicompiat is, in addition to all of its mechanical issues, especially rust pr0ne. The rear subframe in particular is especially bad. The metal is only as thick as body sheet metal when new. Once the salt gets to them they deteriorate very quickly. I've had to weld patches into several rear subframes, but this one that came in takes the cake. It came in for a safety inspection, and I was the lucky guy to do the inspection. The car needed the typical (of these cars) rear trailing link bushings, front lower control arms, rear boomerang links, and rear toe links. What took the cake, though, was the rear subframe. It was completely rotted through to the point that it is not salvageable. It must be replaced. This is a 2008 Caliber with 38k miles on it. It's JUST outside of Chrysler's corrosion warranty. The customer is currently arguing with Chrysler Canada over it. Meanwhile the car sits in our compound, unsafe to drive. Pics:
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: Thunder Chicken on November 30, 2012, 06:19:19 PM
Post by: Thunder Chicken on November 30, 2012, 06:19:19 PM
The sad (and amazing) thing is that the actual unibody structure of the car is near perfect, not even any surface rust. More pics:
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: Thunder Chicken on November 30, 2012, 06:24:04 PM
Post by: Thunder Chicken on November 30, 2012, 06:24:04 PM
Story #2 is a quick one. A customer brings in her 2012 Hyundai Elantra with the donut spare on, asking whether we can fix her tire. I took the tire out of the trunk and quickly saw why it was flat. Needless to say, it was not repairable:
That is a stabilizer link, appears to have come from a Chevy truck. Must have broke off the truck on the road, she ran it over. It went in the sidewall, then back out...
That is a stabilizer link, appears to have come from a Chevy truck. Must have broke off the truck on the road, she ran it over. It went in the sidewall, then back out...
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: Thunder Chicken on November 30, 2012, 06:35:18 PM
Post by: Thunder Chicken on November 30, 2012, 06:35:18 PM
...And story #3 is another quickie. I work at a large used car dealership, and most of the cars we sell are bought at auction. Many of these are from rental companies. Recently I was doing the reconditioning on a 2011 Ford F-250 Super Duty 4X4. It is the longest F250 they make: Crew cab with 8-foot box. Just the kind of truck that would be rented for exploration purposed by, say, an oil company looking for places to drill, or a mining company looking for deposits. That's my theory with what happened to this one. On the shiny side it looked like any other year old work truck: Shiny paint, a few dings here and there...
Underneath, however, was a different story. The mud was caked on the underside of this truck 4" thick. The axle ends were literally gobs of concrete-hard mud, caked onto the brakes & suspension so much that it actually took the shape of (and scored the hell out of) the rims. I had to chip this shiznit away before I could even find the brake calipers. Even the vents in the rotors were clogged solid. Somebody had fun with this truck...
Underneath, however, was a different story. The mud was caked on the underside of this truck 4" thick. The axle ends were literally gobs of concrete-hard mud, caked onto the brakes & suspension so much that it actually took the shape of (and scored the hell out of) the rims. I had to chip this shiznit away before I could even find the brake calipers. Even the vents in the rotors were clogged solid. Somebody had fun with this truck...
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: nbzimmer on November 30, 2012, 08:21:47 PM
Post by: nbzimmer on November 30, 2012, 08:21:47 PM
That seems like an amazing amount of rust for a 2008 with only 38K miles. So I believe what you say about Nova Scotia being a corrosive environment. Crazy . . . .
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: Fordracer08 on November 30, 2012, 09:43:16 PM
Post by: Fordracer08 on November 30, 2012, 09:43:16 PM
Some Moron actually bought that truck at auction to resell? They need a new buyer for sure.
All you have to say is Jeep and you know you will have it coming back to give you work.
All you have to say is Jeep and you know you will have it coming back to give you work.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: 84TBirdTurbo42 on November 30, 2012, 10:46:39 PM
Post by: 84TBirdTurbo42 on November 30, 2012, 10:46:39 PM
wow, that makes the windstar recall look good.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: TheFoeYouKnow on November 30, 2012, 11:27:42 PM
Post by: TheFoeYouKnow on November 30, 2012, 11:27:42 PM
Those Windbag recalls suck.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: thunderjet302 on November 30, 2012, 11:33:12 PM
Post by: thunderjet302 on November 30, 2012, 11:33:12 PM
Does Chrysler even paint the rear subframe on the Calicompiat or do they just leave 'em bare steel? I see cars that have been on the road 20+ years here that look better.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: Beau on December 01, 2012, 01:01:51 AM
Post by: Beau on December 01, 2012, 01:01:51 AM
Jeep=just empty every pocket. Been there, done that. 3 times over. And that was with stuff that was made BEFORE Chrysler got ahold of 'em.
Having worked on a few Durango/Dakotas, and one Ram 1500, I can tell you they are some of less thought-out designs. Of course, a pathetic maintenance schedule -sure didn't help. For that matter, I've owned 3 Dodge/Chrysler cars.
But, regardless of make, every manufacturer in the world has put out stinking steaming piles of utter shiznit. Unfortunately, we here in N America seem to get most of them.
Having worked on a few Durango/Dakotas, and one Ram 1500, I can tell you they are some of less thought-out designs. Of course, a pathetic maintenance schedule -sure didn't help. For that matter, I've owned 3 Dodge/Chrysler cars.
But, regardless of make, every manufacturer in the world has put out stinking steaming piles of utter shiznit. Unfortunately, we here in N America seem to get most of them.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: Thunder Chicken on December 01, 2012, 09:48:51 AM
Post by: Thunder Chicken on December 01, 2012, 09:48:51 AM
Quote from: thunderjet302;403656
Does Chrysler even paint the rear subframe on the Calicompiat or do they just leave 'em bare steel? I see cars that have been on the road 20+ years here that look better.
Quote from: Fordracer08;403646
Some Moron actually bought that truck at auction to resell? They need a new buyer for sure.
All you have to say is Jeep and you know you will have it coming back to give you work.
The rusty Caliber in the first bunch of photos wasn't an auction car, it was a customer's. I actually took those photos for the customer and emailed them to him, so he could go after Chrysler. He's still fighting with them, but if the Chrysler DSM had any sense at all he'd have fixed that thing without question instead of saying "Sorry, you're 16 days out of warranty". I suggested to the customer that he go to the news and to Transport Canada (our equivalent of the NHTSA). The news can embarrass the hell out of Chrysler, Transport Canada can force a recall if they determine it's a safety issue (which, of course, it is). Either one would be far more costly to Chrysler than replacing that subframe would have been...
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: 86cougar on December 01, 2012, 07:16:34 PM
Post by: 86cougar on December 01, 2012, 07:16:34 PM
I see old cars around here and especially in small towns, where cars have been sitting out in the weather for 30-40 years that look great compared to that.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 01, 2012, 08:45:11 PM
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 01, 2012, 08:45:11 PM
Well
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: Thunder Chicken on December 01, 2012, 09:26:48 PM
Post by: Thunder Chicken on December 01, 2012, 09:26:48 PM
I dunno, Tom... I work on all makes & models, everything from Audi to Volvo, Acura to Toyota, and the American brands, and they are all far, far better than the Caliber with one exception. Even cars that are much cheaper (Rio, Accent, Fit, Versa) are much better. I have no "domestic" rose coloured glasses (I'm Canadian, there are no Canadian automobile manufacturers, so they're all imports to me). I don't even have a particular hate on for Chrysler (I own two, a 2005 Chrysler 300 and a 2003 Dakota 4X4). The CaliCompiot are just plain the second-worst cars that have been offered by any manufacturer now and for the past two decades or so, except for the Smart ForTwo which is the absolute worst.
As for your statement about why people buy Hyundai: I bought mine for several reasons:
First, my uncle has an Accent. It's his fifth, and he has had zero problems with any of them, probably three quarters of a million miles between them.
Second, my father has a 2008 Sonata. It's his second, and he has had zero problems with either of his.
Third, my sister has a 2009 Sonata. She's approaching 100k very poorly maintained miles on it. Her only problem was a harsh shifting transmission, which was replaced under that marvelous 100k mile warranty with no hassles whatsoever - they even put her in a courtesy car and delivered the car to her work when it was finished.
Fourth, there's that marvelous warranty. 5 year bumper to bumper. No other manufacturer offers it, except Kia. Ford, GM, Chrysler, Honda, Toyota, Nissan, Mazda all only offer 3/36 warranty, except on the powertrain. And any sensors attached to that powertrain are not covered, so when your Dodge's crankshaft position sensor fails (and it will) it's on your dime. GM is the only one of the lot that covers wheel bearings under powertrain. With Hyundai/Kia it's all covered. The fact that those companies offer cars as cheap as they do, and stand behind them like they do, is nothing shy of spectacular.
Fifth, my 2011 Hyundai Sonata was built in USA. Not Mexico, like the Fusion. Better yet, it was built by non-UAW labour in a right-to-work state. Yes, profits go to Korea. As I said earlier, I'm Canadian. No matter which manufacturer I buy from, the profits go out of the country.
And finally, yes, there is the value aspect. 198 horsepower, six manually selected forward gears, bluetooth and satellite radio, all the power goodies, cruise and A/C, comfortable seating for five, standout styling, an honest 35 MPG (the Sonata was not one of the cars that had their mileage revised, and I routinely see 35MPG or better on highway trips), the best warranty in the business, and all of this for thousands less than any of the competition. Oh, and the 0% financing for 84 months and $1000 gas card helped my decision along as well. Top it all off with a $65 set of true HID's for the low beams and a set of cheap aftermarket alloys for the summer and I've got one hell of a daily driver. 24k miles so far and not a single issue.
As for your statement about why people buy Hyundai: I bought mine for several reasons:
First, my uncle has an Accent. It's his fifth, and he has had zero problems with any of them, probably three quarters of a million miles between them.
Second, my father has a 2008 Sonata. It's his second, and he has had zero problems with either of his.
Third, my sister has a 2009 Sonata. She's approaching 100k very poorly maintained miles on it. Her only problem was a harsh shifting transmission, which was replaced under that marvelous 100k mile warranty with no hassles whatsoever - they even put her in a courtesy car and delivered the car to her work when it was finished.
Fourth, there's that marvelous warranty. 5 year bumper to bumper. No other manufacturer offers it, except Kia. Ford, GM, Chrysler, Honda, Toyota, Nissan, Mazda all only offer 3/36 warranty, except on the powertrain. And any sensors attached to that powertrain are not covered, so when your Dodge's crankshaft position sensor fails (and it will) it's on your dime. GM is the only one of the lot that covers wheel bearings under powertrain. With Hyundai/Kia it's all covered. The fact that those companies offer cars as cheap as they do, and stand behind them like they do, is nothing shy of spectacular.
Fifth, my 2011 Hyundai Sonata was built in USA. Not Mexico, like the Fusion. Better yet, it was built by non-UAW labour in a right-to-work state. Yes, profits go to Korea. As I said earlier, I'm Canadian. No matter which manufacturer I buy from, the profits go out of the country.
And finally, yes, there is the value aspect. 198 horsepower, six manually selected forward gears, bluetooth and satellite radio, all the power goodies, cruise and A/C, comfortable seating for five, standout styling, an honest 35 MPG (the Sonata was not one of the cars that had their mileage revised, and I routinely see 35MPG or better on highway trips), the best warranty in the business, and all of this for thousands less than any of the competition. Oh, and the 0% financing for 84 months and $1000 gas card helped my decision along as well. Top it all off with a $65 set of true HID's for the low beams and a set of cheap aftermarket alloys for the summer and I've got one hell of a daily driver. 24k miles so far and not a single issue.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: Fordracer08 on December 02, 2012, 12:07:51 AM
Post by: Fordracer08 on December 02, 2012, 12:07:51 AM
Yes, I would think the Chrysler DSM would be smart to just fix that subframe and move on. The bad publicity he could get will cost alot more.
I have 28 years in the car business as a mechanic here in PA. I have worked at several new car dealers (Ford, Honda, Toyota, Chrysler/Jeep) and none of them bought auction cars online. We have alot of auto auctions here in PA and the dealers have buyers who go out and purchase cars for them at the auctions. Its interesting to me that they buy vehicles that way at your dealership. I guess as long as they are keeping you in work it's good.
I have 28 years in the car business as a mechanic here in PA. I have worked at several new car dealers (Ford, Honda, Toyota, Chrysler/Jeep) and none of them bought auction cars online. We have alot of auto auctions here in PA and the dealers have buyers who go out and purchase cars for them at the auctions. Its interesting to me that they buy vehicles that way at your dealership. I guess as long as they are keeping you in work it's good.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 03, 2012, 07:50:36 PM
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 03, 2012, 07:50:36 PM
Thunder
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 03, 2012, 07:56:30 PM
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 03, 2012, 07:56:30 PM
First, my uncle has an Accent. It's his fifth,
FIV
FIV
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: Beau on December 03, 2012, 09:57:20 PM
Post by: Beau on December 03, 2012, 09:57:20 PM
Well, if they were utter shiznit, then i doubt the manufacturer would off the best warranties of ALL makes on them.
And there's a reason FWD cars aren't Supercars like your elitist LamboFerraroPorscheshagAllElse.
Can you guess?
Weight distribution.
With that said, if you can't agree that some (not all, and sure not some backyard, stickers-out-the-asshole Civic) front drivers are impressive machines, then you truly need to take another look at something beyond your own parking lot.
Porsches and the italian rich man cars do not impress me one ed bit. For 100,000 bucks or so, it sure as hell ought to be able to run 175, corner like a train, and rip your eyeballs from your head when you mash the brakes. I could build a junkyard shiznitbox Mustang into something that could do all those things for half that.
Point is, to each their own.
/rant.
And there's a reason FWD cars aren't Supercars like your elitist LamboFerraroPorscheshagAllElse.
Can you guess?
Weight distribution.
With that said, if you can't agree that some (not all, and sure not some backyard, stickers-out-the-asshole Civic) front drivers are impressive machines, then you truly need to take another look at something beyond your own parking lot.
Porsches and the italian rich man cars do not impress me one ed bit. For 100,000 bucks or so, it sure as hell ought to be able to run 175, corner like a train, and rip your eyeballs from your head when you mash the brakes. I could build a junkyard shiznitbox Mustang into something that could do all those things for half that.
Point is, to each their own.
/rant.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: CougarSE on December 03, 2012, 10:42:15 PM
Post by: CougarSE on December 03, 2012, 10:42:15 PM
Quote from: TOM Renzo;403861
But trying to convince me a HYUNDAI is a good car is a tough sell.
It's safe to say your school teachers had a hard time convincing you the sky is blue.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: jcassity on December 04, 2012, 09:47:14 AM
Post by: jcassity on December 04, 2012, 09:47:14 AM
wow,
so what metals up there dont decay?
what i mean is a coating to the frame like say what they do to copper as of the past 10 or so years.
They are coating copper with Tin instead of solder.
Truely though, the car makers are reaching for the shortest lifespan possible without poor ratings from customer perception.
People today dont care about small stuff like this, they only care if it "looks" new.
so what metals up there dont decay?
what i mean is a coating to the frame like say what they do to copper as of the past 10 or so years.
They are coating copper with Tin instead of solder.
Truely though, the car makers are reaching for the shortest lifespan possible without poor ratings from customer perception.
People today dont care about small stuff like this, they only care if it "looks" new.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: 50tbrd88 on December 04, 2012, 03:13:02 PM
Post by: 50tbrd88 on December 04, 2012, 03:13:02 PM
A co-worker friend of mine bought one of those Jeeps for his wife (I believe it was the Compass) a couple of years ago when cash for clunkers was going on. He hates it (he calls it his gay jeep).
I think one of the reasons he bought it was that it had a lifetime powertrain warranty (only counts if its the original owner). Is this true? I guess they won't be doing many powertrain warranty claims in 10 yrs if all of these POS's are rusted in two.
I think one of the reasons he bought it was that it had a lifetime powertrain warranty (only counts if its the original owner). Is this true? I guess they won't be doing many powertrain warranty claims in 10 yrs if all of these POS's are rusted in two.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: jcassity on December 04, 2012, 08:16:55 PM
Post by: jcassity on December 04, 2012, 08:16:55 PM
Quote from: TOM Renzo;403860
Thunder Chicken the KIA and HYUNDAI are the biggest pile of garbage i have ever worked on. Bottom line is they are front wheel drive and that says it all. Their is no high end performance cars American or European that are front wheel drive. So as the saying goes. You can lead a horse to water but a pencil must be lead. If you think front wheel drives are the cats ASS so be it .
this 96 kia sophia of my mother in law's does every bit of the speedo,, really fast car. has been a great daily driver as well. body wise and interior,, fairly cheap and we know its nothing more than a 500$ car now at best,, but , it still gets 35+mpg and hauls ass.
id rate it a 10 for dependability and longivity.,, much better than my fox's to be honest. It was cheap when purchased and its cheap now to own and maintain.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: jcassity on December 04, 2012, 08:20:43 PM
Post by: jcassity on December 04, 2012, 08:20:43 PM
Quote from: CougarSE;403893
It's safe to say your school teachers had a hard time convincing you the sky is blue.
LOL, thats because it isnt, the ocean is blue(ish) and to say the sky is blue isnt correct because we only see a reflection.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: Thunder Chicken on December 05, 2012, 07:09:11 PM
Post by: Thunder Chicken on December 05, 2012, 07:09:11 PM
Quote from: TOM Renzo;403861
First, my uncle has an Accent. It's his fifth,
FIVE CARS IN HOW MANY YEARS. I have been driving my Blazer since 1994. It is rotted out but drives flawlessly. If you are talking about rust i agree. But trying to convince me a HYUNDAI is a good car is a tough sell. I did not fall off a TURNIP TRUCK LAST NIGHT!!! But to each his own. If you like them Great. I would have thought with your experience you would have avoided them like the PLAGUE!!! Hay people buy AUDI cars and pay boat loads of money for a car i would not even use for a BOAT ANCHOR!!! just Saying . Be good Tom!!
Five cars since 1995. Over 200k miles on each one of them (he commuted 120 miles a day, every day). One of them was even wrecked twice - once when a Pepsi truck ran into it while it was parked on the side of the road, once when a suicidal deer stuffed itself into the side of it. And it was by my experience, both as a mechanic and by the experience of my family members that I bought that car.
And it's kind of hard to take someone serious when their only argument is "Because they're FWD and FWD totally sucks".
Quote from: jcassity;403912
wow,
so what metals up there dont decay?
what i mean is a coating to the frame like say what they do to copper as of the past 10 or so years.
They are coating copper with Tin instead of solder.
Truely though, the car makers are reaching for the shortest lifespan possible without poor ratings from customer perception.
People today dont care about small stuff like this, they only care if it "looks" new.
I don't know what they coat them with. It's a black primer type coating. Galvanizing zinc plating) helps a bit, but as anyone here who has ever repaired the rockers and quarters in a Fox knows, galvanizing is not a real solution. About the only thing that doesn't rust around here is stainless, and I don't see them making stainless steel cars any time soon. And even stainless rusts apart on exhaust systems...
Quote from: 50tbrd88;403926
A co-worker friend of mine bought one of those Jeeps for his wife (I believe it was the Compass) a couple of years ago when cash for clunkers was going on. He hates it (he calls it his gay jeep).
I think one of the reasons he bought it was that it had a lifetime powertrain warranty (only counts if its the original owner). Is this true? I guess they won't be doing many powertrain warranty claims in 10 yrs if all of these POS's are rusted in two.
Quote from: jcassity;403948
LOL, thats because it isnt, the ocean is blue(ish) and to say the sky is blue isnt correct because we only see a reflection.
You've got that backward, sunshine ;) . The sky's blue because high energy blue light does a better job of getting through the atmosphere. The ocean's blue because it reflects the blue sky.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: Royce 67/87/97 on December 05, 2012, 11:31:33 PM
Post by: Royce 67/87/97 on December 05, 2012, 11:31:33 PM
Quote from: jcassity;403948
LOL, thats because it isnt, the ocean is blue(ish) and to say the sky is blue isnt correct because we only see a reflection.
The science teacher has to interject... The sky is blue (on a clear, sunny day) due to refraction and scattering of light. Blue scatters the most due to its relatively short wavelength. The ocean is blue because of the "reflection" of the blue sky.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: jcassity on December 06, 2012, 01:34:05 AM
Post by: jcassity on December 06, 2012, 01:34:05 AM
there you go, see , we all are probable to arguing the sky is blue or not.
my schooling tought me that the sky was colored blue mainly beacase of the sun and most of the earth being water, the blue color would dominate the sky "because of said water".
ever see a brown looking sky, i have in Takrit Iraq,,, and no wind or sand moving either. its an odd topic but to me if my ground is brown, then it kinda connected with the sky looking litterally like .
i know its all a light show but still.
my schooling tought me that the sky was colored blue mainly beacase of the sun and most of the earth being water, the blue color would dominate the sky "because of said water".
ever see a brown looking sky, i have in Takrit Iraq,,, and no wind or sand moving either. its an odd topic but to me if my ground is brown, then it kinda connected with the sky looking litterally like .
i know its all a light show but still.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 06, 2012, 05:44:26 AM
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 06, 2012, 05:44:26 AM
Five cars since 1995. Over 200k miles on each one of them
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 06, 2012, 05:48:57 AM
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 06, 2012, 05:48:57 AM
ever see a brown looking sky,
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: Thunder Chicken on December 06, 2012, 06:01:41 AM
Post by: Thunder Chicken on December 06, 2012, 06:01:41 AM
Quote from: TOM Renzo;404027
Five cars since 1995. Over 200k miles on each one of them
So are you telling me with a straight face a chevy or a ford cant go 200K. Be it as it may i find it hard to believe that someone in the car business actually can say a HYUNDAI is actually a car. And further more a good car. like i said 90% of American car buyers would not know a good car if it fell on them!!! Tell me a HONDA and we can agree to an extent. But a KIA HYUNDAI. NOT HAPPENING. But buy away i love the MONEY!!! Contractors around these parts have Chevy and ford trucks with plows with 300K on them. Once again as far as i am concerned a FWD car is not a CAR. Just me i like cars that actually do not have all their eggs in one basket. But that is your belief and i am not to judge!! So 20 years from now will we have a bunch of car guys talking about HYUNDAI cars we are saving and restoring for INFAMY??? JUST CHECKING!!!
Where on earth did you ever get the idea that I said Ford and Chevy can't go 200k?
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: TheFoeYouKnow on December 06, 2012, 06:38:57 AM
Post by: TheFoeYouKnow on December 06, 2012, 06:38:57 AM
You know all those beer cans you take back on Monday for 5 or 10 cents? Know where they go? They get crushed and sent to s, and then Korea buys them and THATS THEIR RAW MATERIALS. That's right Your Hyundai/Kia (same company) is a beer can. On wheels. But less fun. And worse, they don't pay diag under warranty, so you end up with dealer techs who are only allowed to throw parts at them.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: FirstBird on December 06, 2012, 07:44:41 AM
Post by: FirstBird on December 06, 2012, 07:44:41 AM
My grandma drives a 2003 Kia Spectra, after she wrecked her 70's Lincoln Versailles, for what it is, it's a good car, hasn't given her any major problems, just regular maintenance, of course it is a tin can but most cars are these days. I don't think anyone expects FWD cars to give any performance other than DD'ing, would I drive it every day? Hell no, wouldn't even think about getting into a Hyundai/Kia. I think people are biased against the Korean car makers( because they're making affordable car) just like they were against puppiesanese a few years ago. In reality as long as it runs and get you from A to B, and isn't a complete death trap, what the hell does it matter?
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: Thunder Chicken on December 06, 2012, 11:27:05 AM
Post by: Thunder Chicken on December 06, 2012, 11:27:05 AM
Foe, you know where else those recycled cans go? Every other manufacturer. They ALL use recycled metal, and many, Ford in particular, uses many other recycled materials (including recycled pop bottles for carpeting). And Chrysler doesn't pay their techs diagnostic time either. Getting paid for diagnostics from GM is like pulling teeth as well, that's why i left GM. Got tired of having to justify every minute of diagnostic time (and only getting paid straight time to do it) while the front-end guy is making a fortune just got old.
And speaking of Chrysler, it's a Chrysler I posted in the first post in this thread with a rotten frame. Suppose that frame was made out of virgin metal?
And speaking of Chrysler, it's a Chrysler I posted in the first post in this thread with a rotten frame. Suppose that frame was made out of virgin metal?
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: jpc647 on December 06, 2012, 11:59:54 AM
Post by: jpc647 on December 06, 2012, 11:59:54 AM
Quote from: TOM Renzo;404027
Five cars since 1995. Over 200k miles on each one of them
So are you telling me with a straight face a chevy or a ford cant go 200K. Be it as it may i find it hard to believe that someone in the car business actually can say a HYUNDAI is actually a car. And further more a good car. like i said 90% of American car buyers would not know a good car if it fell on them!!! Tell me a HONDA and we can agree to an extent. But a KIA HYUNDAI. NOT HAPPENING. But buy away i love the MONEY!!! Contractors around these parts have Chevy and ford trucks with plows with 300K on them. Once again as far as i am concerned a FWD car is not a CAR. Just me i like cars that actually do not have all their eggs in one basket. But that is your belief and i am not to judge!! So 20 years from now will we have a bunch of car guys talking about HYUNDAI cars we are saving and restoring for INFAMY??? JUST CHECKING!!!
I consider my Hyundai a real car. Based on your qualifications, my RWD Genesis Coupe must be. That and the fact that after a little work i'm at just under 300hp/280trq at the wheels, with a 6-speed and get 27/28 mpg on the highway consistently. Sorry but Hyundai and Kia have come a long way in the past 5 years. The new Sonata turbo pulls like a banshee. at 80mph you hit the gas, you feel it. My Genesis kicks the out of a comparable v6 mustang or camaro. Now the new gencoupe was redesigned and with GDI puts out almost 350hp, and some crazy torque. Sorry Troll, but as a DD, you can't beat Hyundai.
My mom had a 2006 Fusion, brand new. Thing was a steaming pile. Leaked all the time, all the switches burned out. Transmission started to vibrate randomly when it was really cold. Sorry, POS. My fully loaded 3.8 with nav, sunroof, heated seats, all the bells and whistles, was less money than her Fusion Brand New. Look at everything I got that I would have paid much more for in a Fusion. My Hyundia isn't a super car, but it's been pretty reliable. It's not perfect, and I have a couple of small warranties, but everyone ask's, what kind of car is that? "That's a What", they say? when's the last time someone wanted to look at the new Camaro, when they were first release? The new GT? Who cares, you see them everywhere.
//end rant.
You can have this 'buy American" attitude all you want. But Hyundai keeps American's employed. Chevy and Ford keep Mexico and Canada employed. What's more important, having profits sent to one man in another country, or keeping tens of thousands or workers in your country employed.
Lastly, your comparing Trucks to Cars. Saying Ford/Chevy trucks are better than cars. Cars are not the same as trucks. Show me a Fusion, or late model impala that go 300k miles. Your whole argument is based on comparing apples to oranges.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: Beau on December 06, 2012, 12:16:58 PM
Post by: Beau on December 06, 2012, 12:16:58 PM
Quote from: jpc647;404045
I consider my Hyundai a real car. Based on your qualifications, my RWD Genesis Coupe must be. That and the fact that after a little work i'm at just under 300hp/280trq at the wheels, with a 6-speed and get 27/28 mpg on the highway consistently. Sorry but Hyundai and Kia have come a long way in the past 5 years. The new Sonata turbo pulls like a banshee. at 80mph you hit the gas, you feel it. My Genesis kicks the out of a comparable v6 mustang or camaro. Now the new gencoupe was redesigned and with GDI puts out almost 350hp, and some crazy torque. Sorry Troll, but as a DD, you can't beat Hyundai.
My mom had a 2006 Fusion, brand new. Thing was a steaming pile. Leaked all the time, all the switches burned out. Transmission started to vibrate randomly when it was really cold. Sorry, POS. My fully loaded 3.8 with nav, sunroof, heated seats, all the bells and whistles, was less money than her Fusion Brand New. Look at everything I got that I would have paid much more for in a Fusion. My Hyundia isn't a super car, but it's been pretty reliable. It's not perfect, and I have a couple of small warranties, but everyone ask's, what kind of car is that? "That's a What", they say? when's the last time someone wanted to look at the new Camaro, when they were first release? The new GT? Who cares, you see them everywhere.
//end rant.
You can have this 'buy American" attitude all you want. But Hyundai keeps American's employed. Chevy and Ford keep Mexico and Canada employed. What's more important, having profits sent to one man in another country, or keeping tens of thousands or workers in your country employed.
Lastly, your comparing Trucks to Cars. Saying Ford/Chevy trucks are better than cars. Cars are not the same as trucks. Show me a Fusion, or late model impala that go 300k miles. Your whole argument is based on comparing apples to oranges.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 06, 2012, 07:22:40 PM
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 06, 2012, 07:22:40 PM
Ok i get it.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: 84TBirdTurbo42 on December 06, 2012, 07:48:31 PM
Post by: 84TBirdTurbo42 on December 06, 2012, 07:48:31 PM
Quote from: TheFoeYouKnow;404034
You know all those beer cans you take back on Monday for 5 or 10 cents? Know where they go? They get crushed and sent to s, and then Korea buys them and THATS THEIR RAW MATERIALS. That's right Your Hyundai/Kia (same company) is a beer can. On wheels. But less fun. And worse, they don't pay diag under warranty, so you end up with dealer techs who are only allowed to throw parts at them.
id totally agree with your statement, but ford doesnt exactly pay for diag anymore haha. theres a reason i left the automotive business. :burnout: never looking back!
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 06, 2012, 07:51:12 PM
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 06, 2012, 07:51:12 PM
2013 Hyundai Genesis 3.8 R-Spec hits 60 mph in 5.3 seconds and costs 32 GRAND. Hay i have a bridge in Brooklyn for sale!!!
And t
And t
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: 84TBirdTurbo42 on December 06, 2012, 07:53:00 PM
Post by: 84TBirdTurbo42 on December 06, 2012, 07:53:00 PM
Quote from: TOM Renzo;404053
OK I GET IT I AM A TROLL. By the way my brother runs central dispatch for NYPD. they have hundreds of IMPALAS with well over 200K. Those cars are not only for police he services all the cars related to NYPD including most munilities. The track record of the IMPALA is well established. With that i do not want to start a fight. And if you think i am a TROLL try keeping a business profitable for as long as i have. With that Drive in to the sunset with your HYUNDAI piece of junk. @ 32k for a 3.8 GT you must have rocks in your head. And as far as looks the GEN is a DOG. I used Trucks as a talking point. By the way in the BODY BUSINESS it amazes me how these cars are built. On the frame machine it tells it all and when you pull those piece of junk cars the story is over. As FOE so correctly points out the BEER cans they make these cars out of is true. Pull one apart and you will see the LABELS. Sorry to say i am a TROLL but telling me a Genesis pulls hard at highway speeds is like saying a mop-head is a motorcycle. YOU MUST BE KIDDING. That is the funniest thing i have ever heard.
Tom. i have respect for your opinion, but why is it you cant for anyone else? you always have to be right. sometimes, your not the only one that is.
as for the fusion, thats odd. any one i worked on as a tech, aside from the shiznit transmission issues that plague ford, has been a great car. i wouldnt heisitate to own one. or a hyundai for that matter.
i'm sorry, out of any of the cars mentioned, i wouldnt own an impala. i think there cheap, everyone of them seems to need a rack due to leaks. idk. just what i've seen. across the country could be completely different.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 06, 2012, 08:03:04 PM
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 06, 2012, 08:03:04 PM
OK i
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: 84TBirdTurbo42 on December 06, 2012, 08:07:54 PM
Post by: 84TBirdTurbo42 on December 06, 2012, 08:07:54 PM
Quote from: TOM Renzo;404059
OK i get it the years in the business does not out weigh some people that never had a car on a rack.
i HAVE 7 years in the business.
Thanks though. your right my opinion is invalid.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 06, 2012, 08:10:56 PM
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 06, 2012, 08:10:56 PM
uu
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: jcassity on December 06, 2012, 09:02:03 PM
Post by: jcassity on December 06, 2012, 09:02:03 PM
i buy american, or own worth while classics i like.
The trick here is loyalty to your countries car heritage.
For me,, all american 100%. lots of people have simply lost thier sense of direction when they say,,"but these korean or puppies cars are made here in the USA". The reason is because of sheer despiration and as a country lowering ourselves to a new low.
I find it depressing to see people so proud to make foreign cars, they feel good for doing something that monetarily they would rather ignore.
I do belive in trading with my neighbors like canada and mexico,, and also sharing in the manuf burden as well. Canada makes some fine steel... just about ever telecommunications company out there uses cananda steel for thier cable racking and auxillary channel.
Mexico once upon a time (perhaps they still do) had a good supply and demand going on. they just need to get thier shiznit together as a country and step back up as a big player in building things.
i gave credit to the kia sophia and its earned some respect from me, but it does not have 279k on it like my 20th or 240k like my 1990 bronco full size windsor. I drive old stuff for several reasons and one is my ability to "still" work on them.
back to py frames being built and terrible corrosion.
Tom~ my wifes Ghia has all the eggs in one basket in the rear, still learning how to work on this thing. I agree with your stand on "go america", reguardless of whats happening now, i wont budge one inch and will always stay loyal to my country.
The trick here is loyalty to your countries car heritage.
For me,, all american 100%. lots of people have simply lost thier sense of direction when they say,,"but these korean or puppies cars are made here in the USA". The reason is because of sheer despiration and as a country lowering ourselves to a new low.
I find it depressing to see people so proud to make foreign cars, they feel good for doing something that monetarily they would rather ignore.
I do belive in trading with my neighbors like canada and mexico,, and also sharing in the manuf burden as well. Canada makes some fine steel... just about ever telecommunications company out there uses cananda steel for thier cable racking and auxillary channel.
Mexico once upon a time (perhaps they still do) had a good supply and demand going on. they just need to get thier shiznit together as a country and step back up as a big player in building things.
i gave credit to the kia sophia and its earned some respect from me, but it does not have 279k on it like my 20th or 240k like my 1990 bronco full size windsor. I drive old stuff for several reasons and one is my ability to "still" work on them.
back to py frames being built and terrible corrosion.
Tom~ my wifes Ghia has all the eggs in one basket in the rear, still learning how to work on this thing. I agree with your stand on "go america", reguardless of whats happening now, i wont budge one inch and will always stay loyal to my country.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 06, 2012, 09:47:44 PM
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 06, 2012, 09:47:44 PM
n ..
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: Beau on December 07, 2012, 12:29:37 AM
Post by: Beau on December 07, 2012, 12:29:37 AM
My sister in law has an impala. What a piece of shiznit. The headlights will randomly shut off, forcing her (or whoever else drives it) to switch them back and forth between high and low to get 'em back on again.
She had another electrical issue, I think ign. switch, cost her a lot of money for both replacement part AND labor.
I do know that labor costs are higher these days, but whoever designed and ignition switch so complicated that it costs over 100 bucks is a f*cking crackhead.
What about the Impala's shiznitbox transmissions? Of course, I must be a shiznithead too, because the vehicle I drive is pr0ne to trans probs (Explorers/Mountaineers).
I too would take a Genesis over an Impala any day. That's after riding in and driving SIL's (supercharged) Impala.
It's not fast either, for a F.I. car, my tbird would slap the shiznit out of it.
What I AM sick of is the "holy shiznit, GM stuff is the best evar!" mentality of certain folks. They break down, same as any other vehicle, and I can say that beyond a shadow of a doubt, I've had more issues with GM stuff ('88 K truck, 94 Caprice) than ALL my Fords added together ('86 Escort GT, '86 Stang, '88 Bird, '88 Bird, '88 Sport, '89 F truck, '89 Stang, '90 Stang, '92 F truck) With the exception of the 90 Stang which ran briefly after I did a little (too much) work to it.
And the hell of it was, both the Chevies were the least abused of the whole ed list. Numerous transmission issues for both, the 305 blew up in the truck, numerous issues with the piece of shiznit LT1 in the Caprice, they both needed new shocks and ball joints before 70,000 miles.....I'll stick to my Fords, Tom. They must not be all THAT bad, as you yourself own a ed TC...
Next time, I'll take a shaging dodge over GM, and that's saying something from me. Why is it that the GM section of almost any junkyard is twice the size of Ford or Dodge sections?
Oh and Tom, your Jim/Blaze is AWD, and is modded...I'd hope it would be a little quicker than something that's nearly as heavy, and down on power...it's ok though, it's faster than my junk and I can sleep at night knowing this. Just don't criticize us younger folks who may not be elite enough to work on Euro cars, or own an AWD SUV....wait, I've worked on a Porsche a coupla times...and I own an AWD SUV......
You have fun with that, now.
She had another electrical issue, I think ign. switch, cost her a lot of money for both replacement part AND labor.
I do know that labor costs are higher these days, but whoever designed and ignition switch so complicated that it costs over 100 bucks is a f*cking crackhead.
What about the Impala's shiznitbox transmissions? Of course, I must be a shiznithead too, because the vehicle I drive is pr0ne to trans probs (Explorers/Mountaineers).
I too would take a Genesis over an Impala any day. That's after riding in and driving SIL's (supercharged) Impala.
It's not fast either, for a F.I. car, my tbird would slap the shiznit out of it.
What I AM sick of is the "holy shiznit, GM stuff is the best evar!" mentality of certain folks. They break down, same as any other vehicle, and I can say that beyond a shadow of a doubt, I've had more issues with GM stuff ('88 K truck, 94 Caprice) than ALL my Fords added together ('86 Escort GT, '86 Stang, '88 Bird, '88 Bird, '88 Sport, '89 F truck, '89 Stang, '90 Stang, '92 F truck) With the exception of the 90 Stang which ran briefly after I did a little (too much) work to it.
And the hell of it was, both the Chevies were the least abused of the whole ed list. Numerous transmission issues for both, the 305 blew up in the truck, numerous issues with the piece of shiznit LT1 in the Caprice, they both needed new shocks and ball joints before 70,000 miles.....I'll stick to my Fords, Tom. They must not be all THAT bad, as you yourself own a ed TC...
Next time, I'll take a shaging dodge over GM, and that's saying something from me. Why is it that the GM section of almost any junkyard is twice the size of Ford or Dodge sections?
Oh and Tom, your Jim/Blaze is AWD, and is modded...I'd hope it would be a little quicker than something that's nearly as heavy, and down on power...it's ok though, it's faster than my junk and I can sleep at night knowing this. Just don't criticize us younger folks who may not be elite enough to work on Euro cars, or own an AWD SUV....wait, I've worked on a Porsche a coupla times...and I own an AWD SUV......
You have fun with that, now.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: jpc647 on December 07, 2012, 12:17:51 PM
Post by: jpc647 on December 07, 2012, 12:17:51 PM
Quote from: TOM Renzo;404053
OK I GET IT I AM A TROLL. By the way my brother runs central dispatch for NYPD. they have hundreds of IMPALAS with well over 200K. Those cars are not only for police he services all the cars related to NYPD including most munilities. The track record of the IMPALA is well established. With that i do not want to start a fight. And if you think i am a TROLL try keeping a business profitable for as long as i have. With that Drive in to the sunset with your HYUNDAI piece of junk. @ 32k for a 3.8 GT you must have rocks in your head. And as far as looks the GEN is a DOG. I used Trucks as a talking point. By the way in the BODY BUSINESS it amazes me how these cars are built. On the frame machine it tells it all and when you pull those piece of junk cars the story is over. As FOE so correctly points out the BEER cans they make these cars out of is true. Pull one apart and you will see the LABELS. Sorry to say i am a TROLL but telling me a Genesis pulls hard at highway speeds is like saying a mop-head is a motorcycle. YOU MUST BE KIDDING. That is the funniest thing i have ever heard.
And you think the Stang or Camaro looks better than the Genesis? I think you head is simply clouded with the “BUY AMERICA” stigma. I agree, a lot of foreign stuff if junk, when I buy parts for my 1972 Oldsmobile, I want American made, because that was built in Framingham MA. Your impala, you think everything on there was build in America, again sir, you are the one with rocks in your head.
Quote from: TOM Renzo;404055
2013 Hyundai Genesis 3.8 R-Spec hits 60 mph in 5.3 seconds and costs 32 GRAND. Hay i have a bridge in Brooklyn for sale!!!
And this is the saturnn 5 rocket you think is fast???
My typhoon does 0-60 100% stock in 4.1 IN THE RAIN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I clearly stated my car wasn’t the fastest. I clearly stated I won’t keep up with a Camaro SS or a 5.0 Gt, but that I can walk all over every v6 Camaro or Stang. For the money, when looking at new cars, it’s a bargain, that was my point. Secondly, I’m doing more to stimulate the economy than you are. I bought a new car, how does driving a 1992 Typhoon help anyone? It doesn’t. What else in that price range has the same power, the same features, and the same warranty. NO ONE!!! Can you build me a car for $30,000 that’ll out handle, get better mileage, have all the same features I have, and stand by it for 10 years? I’ll write you a check right now if you can. If you can match everything the Hyundai does/has, I’ll pay you to build me it; MR. MASTER MECHANIC.
Quote from: TOM Renzo;404061
Another happy Hyundai owner
Review
The 2009 Genesis/4dr Sdn 4.6L V8 I have leased since 07/09 from Sheehy Nissan Hyundai is a true lemon! Even after submitting a lemon law complaint to to dealership and Hyundai Motor America for numerous electrical issues, replacement of the transmission, catalytic converter burn out, interior frnt. windshield condensation build up during the cold months, gear shift sticking on more one occasion, starter switch being replaced, steering column control switch failure, the rubber seal in the sun roof coming out, brake light failure, they still refuse to take this piece of junk back! I believe it's a faulty parts problem as some of their car have had the same issues. Hyundai Assurance (Not)!!!
Quote from: TOM Renzo;404066
Jay as you know we have vendors visit us all the time pushing their cheap . They tell us all sorts of LIES. They give us samples and normally we buy American. Over the years relays have come and gone. But i still like BOSCH relays just to show i am not totally ignorant on quality. For what it is worth i feel passionate about buying American made products. As i despise the puppiesanese and their cars. Reason Americans buy their and we cant even send a BUICK TO puppiesAN. And the Korean JUNK that is flooding our ss are even worse!!! Half the country is still COMMIE. But Americans dont give a dam. Once again people that buy cars 90% of them would not know a good car if it fell on them. They buy cheap junk that either matches their fingernail polish or they say well they are made here. BS they are assembled here. Big difference. But as i should know you cant change peoples minds. No matter how much info you give them. They are set in the aspect that the US cant build anything. Just ask them. This post bashed several American cars. And it comes off their lips like a frozen sky slope. As a business owner i see the writing on the wall. I have to go through 20 vendors to get parts that are either made in places i never heard of. And the us made stuff is always better. But people dont care any more and neither should i. I could care less if a plug comes out of a Korean car or a chevy. But as for me American cars are the best bang for your buck.And always will be. More chevys are on the road for longer amounts of time than any other car. Ask the insurance companies . Also how many times on this message board are guys looking for original ford parts or NOS parts. If all this Korean and foreign stuff is so good why not use fenders like KEYSTONE. SIMPLE THEY ARE !!! And everyone on this site knows it. So they buy cheap cars and to justify that they bash American products. We had to replace our compressor and the sales man tried to sell us some unit made god knows where. I bought an American one. The guy was shocked as he said ingersol was still made here but not selling. AS it was to expensive. But he admitted it was the best unit on the market.
You Can put Lipstick on a pig and dress it up . But the bottom line is it is still a PIG!!!
You seem to come into a lot of threads of try to rile people up. Is this because you hate your job, and this is how you unwind? Half of what you say is some BS philosophy.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: Beau on December 07, 2012, 12:33:36 PM
Post by: Beau on December 07, 2012, 12:33:36 PM
There is no American car company. Period.
If the metal is virgin steel, and every last little part, bolt, wire, gormmet, gasket, what-have-you was made or sourced in the United States, then, and ONLY then would it be an American car.
I don't give a pile of what name is on the trunk lid/tail gate. Nothing is 100% American made.
I worked for 3 years at Dura Automotive, making brake cables for GM stuff. I can tell you we shipped a lot of stuff to Canada, and quite a few of our raw materials came from Mexico, the UK, and I think some of our rubber came from S. America.
Eventually our business went to Mexico, so tell me again how Chevy is 100% US made...
And Tom Renzo, nobody here is bashing you for driving Chevy stuff, so open your mind a little. I've had a lot of problems with the two GM vehicles I have. My grandparents bought both of them brand new. The Caprice had less than 4,000 miles on it when it saw the first of several dealership visits to try to fix the glitchy electronically controlled transmission. It STILL has issues with that. Does EVERY '94-'96 Impala/Caprice/Roadmaster/Fleetwood (the B-Bodies, if you will) have these issues? Hell no.
Lemons exist from every make, so quit bashing jpc because he bought a (seemingly) pretty ed decent car.
If the metal is virgin steel, and every last little part, bolt, wire, gormmet, gasket, what-have-you was made or sourced in the United States, then, and ONLY then would it be an American car.
I don't give a pile of what name is on the trunk lid/tail gate. Nothing is 100% American made.
I worked for 3 years at Dura Automotive, making brake cables for GM stuff. I can tell you we shipped a lot of stuff to Canada, and quite a few of our raw materials came from Mexico, the UK, and I think some of our rubber came from S. America.
Eventually our business went to Mexico, so tell me again how Chevy is 100% US made...
And Tom Renzo, nobody here is bashing you for driving Chevy stuff, so open your mind a little. I've had a lot of problems with the two GM vehicles I have. My grandparents bought both of them brand new. The Caprice had less than 4,000 miles on it when it saw the first of several dealership visits to try to fix the glitchy electronically controlled transmission. It STILL has issues with that. Does EVERY '94-'96 Impala/Caprice/Roadmaster/Fleetwood (the B-Bodies, if you will) have these issues? Hell no.
Lemons exist from every make, so quit bashing jpc because he bought a (seemingly) pretty ed decent car.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: TheFoeYouKnow on December 07, 2012, 12:57:35 PM
Post by: TheFoeYouKnow on December 07, 2012, 12:57:35 PM
, I love a good g match! I love you drink beer when I'm reading you guys, and I nominate you for sporthood.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: thunderjet302 on December 08, 2012, 12:07:27 AM
Post by: thunderjet302 on December 08, 2012, 12:07:27 AM
So if I got this:
Some cars=good
Some cars=bad
Rust=bad
Therefore rusty car=bad
Some cars=good
Some cars=bad
Rust=bad
Therefore rusty car=bad
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: jcassity on December 08, 2012, 03:50:52 PM
Post by: jcassity on December 08, 2012, 03:50:52 PM
Yes, rust is bad, unless you need plenty of it to mix with aluminum oxide to build your own welding system like they did IN AMERICA a hundred year ago.
i see a lot of threads that lean towards "there is no more america" and that in itself is the real issue , ironic it actually is the real root cause of the rust that was found per post 1.
some of you dont have basic economic skills period if you for a moment cant "be open minded enough" to see the real cause to why our GDP is tanking, but im the minority for the moment..... let those occupiers and anarchist moment younger people smoke a big one and complain about not having more free stuff. The same people who would not begin to comprehend a good product because they are not techically capapble of producing anything other than a bowel moment.
i see a lot of threads that lean towards "there is no more america" and that in itself is the real issue , ironic it actually is the real root cause of the rust that was found per post 1.
some of you dont have basic economic skills period if you for a moment cant "be open minded enough" to see the real cause to why our GDP is tanking, but im the minority for the moment..... let those occupiers and anarchist moment younger people smoke a big one and complain about not having more free stuff. The same people who would not begin to comprehend a good product because they are not techically capapble of producing anything other than a bowel moment.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: jcassity on December 08, 2012, 03:58:15 PM
Post by: jcassity on December 08, 2012, 03:58:15 PM
another note,,
it use to be, not so long ago, that when a person became of age with a vast amount of experience and they sure as hell knew what they were talking about,,,, everyone else would close thier mouths and open thier ears.... due to sheer respect. couple that with the fact most of these talented people rarely shared what they knew "unless they saw something in you" then they would mentor you.
Now a days, if someone knows stuff, the majority of people have "computer balls" and they bash the people who know stuff.
When i was a couple decades younger we use to call these people the "know it alls" and its my observation that these people who are Type A personality who appear to "know it all", 8 out of 10 of them actually do. So, end result for me was to "put up with the BS" because learning from the know it alls cant be all that bad.
today, 8 out of 10 people dont care to know much of anything because if they did, they might have to work.
it use to be, not so long ago, that when a person became of age with a vast amount of experience and they sure as hell knew what they were talking about,,,, everyone else would close thier mouths and open thier ears.... due to sheer respect. couple that with the fact most of these talented people rarely shared what they knew "unless they saw something in you" then they would mentor you.
Now a days, if someone knows stuff, the majority of people have "computer balls" and they bash the people who know stuff.
When i was a couple decades younger we use to call these people the "know it alls" and its my observation that these people who are Type A personality who appear to "know it all", 8 out of 10 of them actually do. So, end result for me was to "put up with the BS" because learning from the know it alls cant be all that bad.
today, 8 out of 10 people dont care to know much of anything because if they did, they might have to work.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: Haystack on December 08, 2012, 10:20:40 PM
Post by: Haystack on December 08, 2012, 10:20:40 PM
There isn't the america I grew up in, or the america my father envisioned, or the coutry my grandfather helped build. Just plain and simple.
puppiesanland cars are popular because american cars lacked build quality, and were way behind on gas mileage. Toyota's rot away to nothing, inside of "truck" frames, yet they are still on the roads. Toyota did a gigantic "buy back" program. I can see ford, gm, and dodge weaseling their way out of this one instantly. Gm went bankrupt and cost our country millions of dollars, cut jobs, closed factories, and moved production over boarders and over seas. Then decided not to pay it back.
I am reminded of an old 1980's dodge higher up quote. "Here at chrysler we borrow money the old fashioned way, we pay it back".
The "greatest generation" brought american from the joke of the world, to a super power that conqoured the conquers, built, borrowed and maintained hundrends of thousands of military vehicles, built our modern day freeway system and created the "greatest economy" in the modern day. What have the baby boomers done? Taken the wealth of this nation, pocketed it, hid it, moved over seas, and used our government as the scape goat. Our government was trying to sue ford for NOT taking bail out money that they DIDN'T ask for.
Why is harbor freight huge, but craftsman is dying? Because there is no pride in the industry. When china stands behind and builds a better broduct, for cheaper, why buy the inferior more expensive product?
We are victims of our own doing, and the idea is pass the buck onto the next guy, your sons and dughters, and then your grand children.
If gm can't build cars profitably, why are they still in business? Same with dodge. At least ford decided to try to fix their problems instead of holdig their hands out and asking for welfare.
Imagine if we had volintary rations for products and services now because of a war our contry was fighting. That would be a waste of time.
The problem is the people that would rather take the easy way out, pass the buck onto someone else, and hold out their hands. This is the way my generation was taught. This is the reason for the sad state we are in.
puppiesanland cars are popular because american cars lacked build quality, and were way behind on gas mileage. Toyota's rot away to nothing, inside of "truck" frames, yet they are still on the roads. Toyota did a gigantic "buy back" program. I can see ford, gm, and dodge weaseling their way out of this one instantly. Gm went bankrupt and cost our country millions of dollars, cut jobs, closed factories, and moved production over boarders and over seas. Then decided not to pay it back.
I am reminded of an old 1980's dodge higher up quote. "Here at chrysler we borrow money the old fashioned way, we pay it back".
The "greatest generation" brought american from the joke of the world, to a super power that conqoured the conquers, built, borrowed and maintained hundrends of thousands of military vehicles, built our modern day freeway system and created the "greatest economy" in the modern day. What have the baby boomers done? Taken the wealth of this nation, pocketed it, hid it, moved over seas, and used our government as the scape goat. Our government was trying to sue ford for NOT taking bail out money that they DIDN'T ask for.
Why is harbor freight huge, but craftsman is dying? Because there is no pride in the industry. When china stands behind and builds a better broduct, for cheaper, why buy the inferior more expensive product?
We are victims of our own doing, and the idea is pass the buck onto the next guy, your sons and dughters, and then your grand children.
If gm can't build cars profitably, why are they still in business? Same with dodge. At least ford decided to try to fix their problems instead of holdig their hands out and asking for welfare.
Imagine if we had volintary rations for products and services now because of a war our contry was fighting. That would be a waste of time.
The problem is the people that would rather take the easy way out, pass the buck onto someone else, and hold out their hands. This is the way my generation was taught. This is the reason for the sad state we are in.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: Haystack on December 08, 2012, 10:20:53 PM
Post by: Haystack on December 08, 2012, 10:20:53 PM
There isn't the america I grew up in, or the america my father envisioned, or the coutry my grandfather helped build. Just plain and simple.
puppiesanland cars are popular because american cars lacked build quality, and were way behind on gas mileage. Toyota's rot away to nothing, inside of "truck" frames, yet they are still on the roads. Toyota did a gigantic "buy back" program. I can see ford, gm, and dodge weaseling their way out of this one instantly. Gm went bankrupt and cost our country millions of dollars, cut jobs, closed factories, and moved production over boarders and over seas. Then decided not to pay it back.
I am reminded of an old 1980's dodge higher up quote. "Here at chrysler we borrow money the old fashioned way, we pay it back".
The "greatest generation" brought american from the joke of the world, to a super power that conqoured the conquers, built, borrowed and maintained hundrends of thousands of military vehicles, built our modern day freeway system and created the "greatest economy" in the modern day. What have the baby boomers done? Taken the wealth of this nation, pocketed it, hid it, moved over seas, and used our government as the scape goat. Our government was trying to sue ford for NOT taking bail out money that they DIDN'T ask for.
Why is harbor freight huge, but craftsman is dying? Because there is no pride in the industry. When china stands behind and builds a better broduct, for cheaper, why buy the inferior more expensive product?
We are victims of our own doing, and the idea is pass the buck onto the next guy, your sons and dughters, and then your grand children.
If gm can't build cars profitably, why are they still in business? Same with dodge. At least ford decided to try to fix their problems instead of holdig their hands out and asking for welfare.
Imagine if we had volintary rations for products and services now because of a war our contry was fighting. That would be a waste of time.
The problem is the people that would rather take the easy way out, pass the buck onto someone else, and hold out their hands. This is the way my generation was taught. This is the reason for the sad state we are in.
puppiesanland cars are popular because american cars lacked build quality, and were way behind on gas mileage. Toyota's rot away to nothing, inside of "truck" frames, yet they are still on the roads. Toyota did a gigantic "buy back" program. I can see ford, gm, and dodge weaseling their way out of this one instantly. Gm went bankrupt and cost our country millions of dollars, cut jobs, closed factories, and moved production over boarders and over seas. Then decided not to pay it back.
I am reminded of an old 1980's dodge higher up quote. "Here at chrysler we borrow money the old fashioned way, we pay it back".
The "greatest generation" brought american from the joke of the world, to a super power that conqoured the conquers, built, borrowed and maintained hundrends of thousands of military vehicles, built our modern day freeway system and created the "greatest economy" in the modern day. What have the baby boomers done? Taken the wealth of this nation, pocketed it, hid it, moved over seas, and used our government as the scape goat. Our government was trying to sue ford for NOT taking bail out money that they DIDN'T ask for.
Why is harbor freight huge, but craftsman is dying? Because there is no pride in the industry. When china stands behind and builds a better broduct, for cheaper, why buy the inferior more expensive product?
We are victims of our own doing, and the idea is pass the buck onto the next guy, your sons and dughters, and then your grand children.
If gm can't build cars profitably, why are they still in business? Same with dodge. At least ford decided to try to fix their problems instead of holdig their hands out and asking for welfare.
Imagine if we had volintary rations for products and services now because of a war our contry was fighting. That would be a waste of time.
The problem is the people that would rather take the easy way out, pass the buck onto someone else, and hold out their hands. This is the way my generation was taught. This is the reason for the sad state we are in.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 08, 2012, 11:44:57 PM
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 08, 2012, 11:44:57 PM
You seem
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: Beau on December 09, 2012, 12:11:09 AM
Post by: Beau on December 09, 2012, 12:11:09 AM
Put your egos away. All of you, and I will as well.
I'm no anarchist, although I think that one is likely to happen in 20 years or less. As far as smoking a fat one...no, I can follow a ed dodge minivan and get quite the headache from burning chemicals, no need to do it illegally, so don't know where you were going with that.
How can you tell a good car from a bad car, simply by being a bodyman? Are you senile? :rollin:
As far as quality in the "domestics" vs. the "imports", it's all the same. When Ford/GM/Chrysler-Fiat can give a vehicle a 10 year/100,000 mile warranty, come to me about quality. I don't give a how long anyone has been wiping their ass on a sear catalog, you don't see tons of hyundai, kia, or (insert brand here) in the junkyard with spit-out plugs, failed optisparks, junk shaging allison transmissions, or rusted rear subframes ala Compiat.
Tom, it's not that I have no respect for you (or anyone else for that matter) it's your arrogance towards ALL who've not had greasy hands since 1907. I can tell you this, I'm pretty well read on all the current car magazines, I can argue quality, sales, and general stats all day long, but I don't care to. Got better things to do.
ALL today's vehicles have thinner metal, or more plastic. Weight savings, because every last mother's son wants heated ball scratchers, and a ed bluetooth. All the fancy shiznit comes with a price. Weight. Add in the ever increasing mileage requirements, safety, such, and we wonder why shiznit is meant to last a lot less than our older cars and trucks.
As far as the past generations, America brought it on itself. Wanting more for less, unions, modernizing, etc. I could go on and on here, but this place frowns on political talk, so on that note, I'm gonna STFU. The thing that remains: buy your American Chevy, Dodge, Ford, whatever, buy a ed Yugo, I don't effing care. I'll stick with my 15 year old SUV that's reliable, comfortable, and if something breaks, I can fix it without having to have a degree. Like you, I've made my mind up about my favorite makes of vehicles. I've had rotten shiznitty luck with Chevy. You want to drive 'em and build, more power to ya. I don't give a , my life will continue, as will yours. But do NOT come off as condescending to me because I don't have a gold plated hard-on for GM shiznit.
One last thing....seems like YOU are the one comes into threads, riling people up. Seems like you and your boy both have done it on a couple of boards. Don't throw rocks in a glass house, pops.
Or maybe I'm just bitter because YOUR car company had to take loans from uncle sam to stay afloat...yep, that has to be it. Just a bitter twisted soul. :poke:
I'm no anarchist, although I think that one is likely to happen in 20 years or less. As far as smoking a fat one...no, I can follow a ed dodge minivan and get quite the headache from burning chemicals, no need to do it illegally, so don't know where you were going with that.
How can you tell a good car from a bad car, simply by being a bodyman? Are you senile? :rollin:
As far as quality in the "domestics" vs. the "imports", it's all the same. When Ford/GM/Chrysler-Fiat can give a vehicle a 10 year/100,000 mile warranty, come to me about quality. I don't give a how long anyone has been wiping their ass on a sear catalog, you don't see tons of hyundai, kia, or (insert brand here) in the junkyard with spit-out plugs, failed optisparks, junk shaging allison transmissions, or rusted rear subframes ala Compiat.
Tom, it's not that I have no respect for you (or anyone else for that matter) it's your arrogance towards ALL who've not had greasy hands since 1907. I can tell you this, I'm pretty well read on all the current car magazines, I can argue quality, sales, and general stats all day long, but I don't care to. Got better things to do.
ALL today's vehicles have thinner metal, or more plastic. Weight savings, because every last mother's son wants heated ball scratchers, and a ed bluetooth. All the fancy shiznit comes with a price. Weight. Add in the ever increasing mileage requirements, safety, such, and we wonder why shiznit is meant to last a lot less than our older cars and trucks.
As far as the past generations, America brought it on itself. Wanting more for less, unions, modernizing, etc. I could go on and on here, but this place frowns on political talk, so on that note, I'm gonna STFU. The thing that remains: buy your American Chevy, Dodge, Ford, whatever, buy a ed Yugo, I don't effing care. I'll stick with my 15 year old SUV that's reliable, comfortable, and if something breaks, I can fix it without having to have a degree. Like you, I've made my mind up about my favorite makes of vehicles. I've had rotten shiznitty luck with Chevy. You want to drive 'em and build, more power to ya. I don't give a , my life will continue, as will yours. But do NOT come off as condescending to me because I don't have a gold plated hard-on for GM shiznit.
One last thing....seems like YOU are the one comes into threads, riling people up. Seems like you and your boy both have done it on a couple of boards. Don't throw rocks in a glass house, pops.
Or maybe I'm just bitter because YOUR car company had to take loans from uncle sam to stay afloat...yep, that has to be it. Just a bitter twisted soul. :poke:
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 09, 2012, 06:52:30 AM
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 09, 2012, 06:52:30 AM
@ JPC 647
You s
You s
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: Thunder Chicken on December 09, 2012, 07:36:31 AM
Post by: Thunder Chicken on December 09, 2012, 07:36:31 AM
Wow, did this thread ever go sideways...
Back on topic:
This post should show that A) It's not just steel that rots out in Nova Scotia - aluminum is not safe either and B) it's not just Asian stuff. As the last photo shows, this failed component was made in USA. So...
The other day a certain 2007 model truck was towed in with a no-start condition. The customer stated that he could make it run by spraying quik-start into the throttle body, which indicated no fuel. Having played knifey-spooney before (this is a Simpsons reference), I knew the first place to look. I dropped the spare tire (itself a daunting task on the rusted out hulks we drive) and sure enough, I found this:
This is the fuel pump driver module (FPDM) from a 2007 Ford Explorer Sport Trac. As you can see the aluminum housing has completely corroded away, leaving the electronic guts exposed to the weather. Ford mounts these on the frame, usually above the spare tire, where things get wet and stay wet. It's common to see them go, although I'll admit this is one of the worst examples I've seen. The amazing thing here isn't that the truck wouldn't start, it's that it ran as long as it did...
...And here is the front side of the offending part. This was an American made part on an American made vehicle, so please, let's dispense with the "Everything foreign is junk" bullshiznit. They all break, and my making a living depends on it...
Back on topic:
This post should show that A) It's not just steel that rots out in Nova Scotia - aluminum is not safe either and B) it's not just Asian stuff. As the last photo shows, this failed component was made in USA. So...
The other day a certain 2007 model truck was towed in with a no-start condition. The customer stated that he could make it run by spraying quik-start into the throttle body, which indicated no fuel. Having played knifey-spooney before (this is a Simpsons reference), I knew the first place to look. I dropped the spare tire (itself a daunting task on the rusted out hulks we drive) and sure enough, I found this:
This is the fuel pump driver module (FPDM) from a 2007 Ford Explorer Sport Trac. As you can see the aluminum housing has completely corroded away, leaving the electronic guts exposed to the weather. Ford mounts these on the frame, usually above the spare tire, where things get wet and stay wet. It's common to see them go, although I'll admit this is one of the worst examples I've seen. The amazing thing here isn't that the truck wouldn't start, it's that it ran as long as it did...
...And here is the front side of the offending part. This was an American made part on an American made vehicle, so please, let's dispense with the "Everything foreign is junk" bullshiznit. They all break, and my making a living depends on it...
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: Thunder Chicken on December 09, 2012, 07:57:03 AM
Post by: Thunder Chicken on December 09, 2012, 07:57:03 AM
Another one, with no photos this time: We had a 2005 Freestar on the lot that ran like a bag of shiznit every time it rained. If you could keep it running long enough to drive it, the transmission wouldn't shift right. A quick scan revealed codes for the camshaft position sensor as well as various transmission sensors. Looking at the wiring diagrams I saw that all of the affected sensors shared a 5V reference signal. I checked the wiring and everything looked OK, so I determined the cause to be the computer. When I went to order one, the dealership told me they needed some numbers off the old one (kinda like the old A4L, DA9, etc). I went to remove the computer, which is mounted in the firewall, directly under the wiper cowl. When I pulled it out, at least a pint of water ran out of it. I gave Ford the number and they told me it'd be a few weeks until a new one would arrive.
I went back out to the shop and decided to open up the old computer. When I did, I found no visible signs of damage to the motherboard or its components. I plugged it into the harness (with no case on it), started the vehicle, and it ran fine. A quick road test verified the trans was shifting fine too. So the computer wasn't actually bad, it was just scrambling signals thanks to the water that was inside it. I then started thinking that if I install a new computer it will only do the same thing, thanks to Ford's really stupid decision to mount it where they did. So I blew off the motherboard with compressed air, sprayed it with electrical parts cleaner, put it back in its case, and goobered the hell out of it with ultra black silicone. I reinstalled the computer into the van, then goobered up the firewall with silicone around where the computer goes through to prevent water from getting in. Some tweaks to the metal on the wiper cowl and some strategic placement of silicone and strip caulk to divert water away from the area, and everything was reinstalled. Took it for a road test, and it was great. Drove it home a few nights in torrential rains, no problems, and it has worked fine ever since (this was in September)...
It has always bugged me that the engineers that make these stupid decisions get paid so much more than those of us who fix their mistakes do...
I went back out to the shop and decided to open up the old computer. When I did, I found no visible signs of damage to the motherboard or its components. I plugged it into the harness (with no case on it), started the vehicle, and it ran fine. A quick road test verified the trans was shifting fine too. So the computer wasn't actually bad, it was just scrambling signals thanks to the water that was inside it. I then started thinking that if I install a new computer it will only do the same thing, thanks to Ford's really stupid decision to mount it where they did. So I blew off the motherboard with compressed air, sprayed it with electrical parts cleaner, put it back in its case, and goobered the hell out of it with ultra black silicone. I reinstalled the computer into the van, then goobered up the firewall with silicone around where the computer goes through to prevent water from getting in. Some tweaks to the metal on the wiper cowl and some strategic placement of silicone and strip caulk to divert water away from the area, and everything was reinstalled. Took it for a road test, and it was great. Drove it home a few nights in torrential rains, no problems, and it has worked fine ever since (this was in September)...
It has always bugged me that the engineers that make these stupid decisions get paid so much more than those of us who fix their mistakes do...
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: Thunder Chicken on December 09, 2012, 08:02:51 AM
Post by: Thunder Chicken on December 09, 2012, 08:02:51 AM
...And a quick, funny one: The sales department, for some reason, likes to put the hoods up on all of the cars that are close to the road, next to the sidewalk. They do this in all kinds of weather, which keeps us mechanics busy replacing seized alternators, soggy ignition coils, etc. One time a 4-cyl Ford Fusion came in from the front lot with a high idle and a check engine light on. I scanned it and found a bunch of lean and idle-out-of-range codes. I opened the hood and immediately saw the problem: Somebody walking by took the open hood as an invitation for a prank and pulled off all the vacuum lines. They didn't steal them, they just pulled them all off...
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: TheFoeYouKnow on December 09, 2012, 08:53:17 AM
Post by: TheFoeYouKnow on December 09, 2012, 08:53:17 AM
We see a lot of those FPDMs rot like that, but I have to place the blame on where they're mounted. You live in salt country, just like I do, and we all know nobody ever bothers to clean their undercarriage. Personally, I like to paint the new one before I install it, I've been doing that since 06 when I first saw one rotted out and I haven't seen any repeats.
In the case of the Freestar, I believe there's a TSB pertaining to water entry into the PCM mounting area. If memory serves, it states to apply XG-3A to the EEC connector and around the cover seal. Check OASIS on the next one, you may find it.
If your sales department is anything like mine, you've got to know that in their minds we (service) don't exist and that THEY are the whole show. Why? Because they're stupid, as evidence suggests. You can fix ignorant, but you can't fix stupid.
In the case of the Freestar, I believe there's a TSB pertaining to water entry into the PCM mounting area. If memory serves, it states to apply XG-3A to the EEC connector and around the cover seal. Check OASIS on the next one, you may find it.
If your sales department is anything like mine, you've got to know that in their minds we (service) don't exist and that THEY are the whole show. Why? Because they're stupid, as evidence suggests. You can fix ignorant, but you can't fix stupid.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: 84TBirdTurbo42 on December 09, 2012, 10:29:30 AM
Post by: 84TBirdTurbo42 on December 09, 2012, 10:29:30 AM
here we go again..... but anyways.
Common, you just listed all the stuff i used to make money on haha. E-150, F-150 fpdm are the same, mounting wise, no. but i always kept a spare one in my tool box, for quick diag and ease of not having to push one of those big s in.
Freestar, Windbag, they were just so terrible, i get scared everytime i see them on the road. Waiting for the rear axle on every ignorant windstar driver who did get the band aid recalls done to come into my lane when it breaks. FORD should have bought them all back. Even if it was just for peanuts. not the 6,000 dollars i saw given out when i was a service advisor at the time.
as for other cars, to me it always seemed like the older jeep liberty's were shiznit.
its sad really. some cars i can tell from the 2012 model year are just not going to hold up well, its sad really.
i think the 2013 escape is just going to be . same with the focus. this new global platform just seemed really cheap to me.
Common, you just listed all the stuff i used to make money on haha. E-150, F-150 fpdm are the same, mounting wise, no. but i always kept a spare one in my tool box, for quick diag and ease of not having to push one of those big s in.
Freestar, Windbag, they were just so terrible, i get scared everytime i see them on the road. Waiting for the rear axle on every ignorant windstar driver who did get the band aid recalls done to come into my lane when it breaks. FORD should have bought them all back. Even if it was just for peanuts. not the 6,000 dollars i saw given out when i was a service advisor at the time.
as for other cars, to me it always seemed like the older jeep liberty's were shiznit.
its sad really. some cars i can tell from the 2012 model year are just not going to hold up well, its sad really.
i think the 2013 escape is just going to be . same with the focus. this new global platform just seemed really cheap to me.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: jcassity on December 09, 2012, 11:03:47 AM
Post by: jcassity on December 09, 2012, 11:03:47 AM
what a terrible place for a fuel pump driver module, open to the world ready to catch all that can be splashed upon it.
bad engineering.
bad engineering.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: thunderjet302 on December 09, 2012, 10:06:36 PM
Post by: thunderjet302 on December 09, 2012, 10:06:36 PM
Quote from: Thunder Chicken;404225
Wow, did this thread ever go sideways...
Back on topic:
This post should show that A) It's not just steel that rots out in Nova Scotia - aluminum is not safe either and B) it's not just Asian stuff. As the last photo shows, this failed component was made in USA. So...
The other day a certain 2007 model truck was towed in with a no-start condition. The customer stated that he could make it run by spraying quik-start into the throttle body, which indicated no fuel. Having played knifey-spooney before (this is a Simpsons reference), I knew the first place to look. I dropped the spare tire (itself a daunting task on the rusted out hulks we drive) and sure enough, I found this:
This is the fuel pump driver module (FPDM) from a 2007 Ford Explorer Sport Trac. As you can see the aluminum housing has completely corroded away, leaving the electronic guts exposed to the weather. Ford mounts these on the frame, usually above the spare tire, where things get wet and stay wet. It's common to see them go, although I'll admit this is one of the worst examples I've seen. The amazing thing here isn't that the truck wouldn't start, it's that it ran as long as it did...
...And here is the front side of the offending part. This was an American made part on an American made vehicle, so please, let's dispense with the "Everything foreign is junk" bullshiznit. They all break, and my making a living depends on it...
I think we have salt problems but I've never seen an aluminum component rot out here.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: Crazy88 on December 10, 2012, 10:48:48 PM
Post by: Crazy88 on December 10, 2012, 10:48:48 PM
Quote from: Royce 67/87/97;404015
The science teacher has to interject... The sky is blue (on a clear, sunny day) due to refraction and scattering of light. Blue scatters the most due to its relatively short wavelength. The ocean is blue because of the "reflection" of the blue sky.
I started to correct someone, but thought better of it, since it really wasn't the topic of discussion. ;)
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: cougarcragar on December 10, 2012, 11:41:42 PM
Post by: cougarcragar on December 10, 2012, 11:41:42 PM
Quote from: Thunder Chicken;404225
Having played knifey-spooney before (this is a Simpsons reference)...
"All right, all right, you win. Heh, I can see you've played knifey-spooney before!
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: shame302 on December 14, 2012, 12:24:37 PM
Post by: shame302 on December 14, 2012, 12:24:37 PM
Today I learned that all:
Front wheel drive cars are junk and do not qualify as a "real car".
Asian cars are junk.
100K mile/10 year hassle free warranties are junk.
Buying "American made automobiles" is still a "thing".
and finally GM should have stopped producing vehicles with the typhoon/syclone trucks as these were automotive engineering perfection. What everybody should want and must have is a 14 second early 90's GMC Jimmy.
Front wheel drive cars are junk and do not qualify as a "real car".
Asian cars are junk.
100K mile/10 year hassle free warranties are junk.
Buying "American made automobiles" is still a "thing".
and finally GM should have stopped producing vehicles with the typhoon/syclone trucks as these were automotive engineering perfection. What everybody should want and must have is a 14 second early 90's GMC Jimmy.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 14, 2012, 01:32:03 PM
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 14, 2012, 01:32:03 PM
hhh
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 14, 2012, 01:41:27 PM
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 14, 2012, 01:41:27 PM
jjj
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: Beau on December 14, 2012, 04:03:15 PM
Post by: Beau on December 14, 2012, 04:03:15 PM
Quote from: TOM Renzo;404544
It seems like my presence here is taken very lightly and i seem to amuse people here.
When you come off as an arrogant douchebag, constantly post w in others' threads with your Chevy nonsense that doesn't pertain to the topic, and insult other people's choice in vehicles, it tends to come back to ya.
I don't have a personal issue with you, other than the way you look down on people because they don't think that a bow tie product is the be-all, end-all vehicle.
With THAT said, Merry Christmas to you and your family. :)
And then you go back and edit your posts to say something like "uu", for what reason, i don't know. I wish this place was like the 'bullet and the corral, no editing allowed.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: shame302 on December 14, 2012, 04:33:19 PM
Post by: shame302 on December 14, 2012, 04:33:19 PM
Quote
Dont worry shame you will not hear from me any more
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 14, 2012, 09:36:06 PM
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 14, 2012, 09:36:06 PM
Ok
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: Beau on December 14, 2012, 09:41:01 PM
Post by: Beau on December 14, 2012, 09:41:01 PM
:rollin::popcorn:
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 14, 2012, 09:44:39 PM
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 14, 2012, 09:44:39 PM
?????
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 14, 2012, 09:55:18 PM
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 14, 2012, 09:55:18 PM
Tha
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: Beau on December 14, 2012, 10:14:48 PM
Post by: Beau on December 14, 2012, 10:14:48 PM
Hi Tom. My name is Beau.
No, the opti did not sour me. I also don't get a nut by bashing GM every time I get the chance.
I also know that nobody is too old to learn something. Leave, stay. Not my drama to dwell on, but yours.
There's a reason some here call you a troll. You bait arguments, such as this one. I feel stupid for walking into it, and i can assure, it won't be a decision I make again.
Like I said, arrogance repels me. It's also before ignorance in the dictionary. Funny how humility is further down the list.
Thanks for the tips and info you have posted here. Now I think it's time to hide some people who tend to start the same old argument, thread after thread.
Love and peace.
No, the opti did not sour me. I also don't get a nut by bashing GM every time I get the chance.
I also know that nobody is too old to learn something. Leave, stay. Not my drama to dwell on, but yours.
There's a reason some here call you a troll. You bait arguments, such as this one. I feel stupid for walking into it, and i can assure, it won't be a decision I make again.
Like I said, arrogance repels me. It's also before ignorance in the dictionary. Funny how humility is further down the list.
Thanks for the tips and info you have posted here. Now I think it's time to hide some people who tend to start the same old argument, thread after thread.
Love and peace.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: Chrome on December 15, 2012, 01:09:04 AM
Post by: Chrome on December 15, 2012, 01:09:04 AM
Wow! I missed a lot with this thread. I've been battling Tom on another thread.
Beau, you are a wise man. Agree with your last few posts 100%.
Beau, you are a wise man. Agree with your last few posts 100%.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: T-BirdX3 on December 15, 2012, 09:31:37 AM
Post by: T-BirdX3 on December 15, 2012, 09:31:37 AM
Cool another thread of throwing. Thanks for reminding me why I quit visiting this site!
Have a great day friends! :D
Have a great day friends! :D
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 15, 2012, 04:32:26 PM
Post by: TOM Renzo on December 15, 2012, 04:32:26 PM
Ok Beau i did not know your name. Well i thought about what you said and to some extent i agree. So as i have my own conclusions of things and i use my experience i also dont want to insult anyone on the cars they own. But talking about cars is always controversial. Years ago it was Chevy V Ford. Now it is Foreign V American. I can understand why people buy certain cars for cost ETC. But on the other hand are the cars better, Just because they come with all kinds of warranties does not make them GOOD. It is come to light that we Americans build good cars and always have. But some use excuses and reasons not to own certain makes and models. With that it is clear that discussing this is like Politics ETC. Some are of different beliefs. Be it as it may i guess the bottom line here is some do not care about cars enough to decide which one is better than the next. Like i said i only see cars when they are busted. Weather foreign or domestic it makes no difference to me. So with that i will refrain from commenting on things of quality or origin of where they come from. As i say i dont care where they come from as long as the bottom line is money in the bank. Now Thunder chicken showed a rotted sub frame and this can happen for different reasons. What he does not understand is this is how he makes money and so do i. If cars did not break i close the shop doors and send 9 people to the unemployment line. So as i have a masters in engineering i was once asked by my professor many years ago to answer a question. If i got it wrong he said i would never graduate Here goes
Does a suspension bridge roadway that is cable strung like a BOW. With vertical cables. vary it's roadway from summer to winter. Another words does the roadway get longer or shorter in the summer. So with that i took your advice and wont trash anyones ride . Other than help with questions and answers if i can. By the way i answered the question correctly. I am also not here to bait anyone just help out with problems. OK and maybe if you and chrome will start over so will I. DEAL.
BUT I STILL LOVE CHEVYS as i know you do also. I am willing to bet that. Thanks and Sorry Tom
Does a suspension bridge roadway that is cable strung like a BOW. With vertical cables. vary it's roadway from summer to winter. Another words does the roadway get longer or shorter in the summer. So with that i took your advice and wont trash anyones ride . Other than help with questions and answers if i can. By the way i answered the question correctly. I am also not here to bait anyone just help out with problems. OK and maybe if you and chrome will start over so will I. DEAL.
BUT I STILL LOVE CHEVYS as i know you do also. I am willing to bet that. Thanks and Sorry Tom
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: jcassity on December 15, 2012, 08:43:48 PM
Post by: jcassity on December 15, 2012, 08:43:48 PM
This is starting to look a lot better, But I don't really have much room to talk so am I'll back out now
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: Chrome on December 16, 2012, 12:16:21 AM
Post by: Chrome on December 16, 2012, 12:16:21 AM
Tom, you can call me Derik. You're not a bad guy, just a little high strung....er... lot high strung. Perhaps you can drink a beer or three before visiting. I found it odd that you said people from other forums said your inventions and clever repairs is the cause of the problem. When that is what the thread is about, you are at your best.... calm, and informative. I loved to read about your dizzy modifications. The smoke machine was totaly cool.I think you have already learned to keep certain ideas to yourself. Now, to go with that, if you see something you don't like or agree with, take a second look. You have seen more than we ever will, but you still don't know it all. If you look closer and try to see things from a different light, you may learn something. I will try not to engage when you go too far. Now, lets do better, and prevent more posts like #76.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: Beau on December 16, 2012, 12:41:03 AM
Post by: Beau on December 16, 2012, 12:41:03 AM
Exactly^.
I'll work on some stuff too...I'm not the FTBCF police and I never want to be. Then of course the tragedy yesterday, and now I regret the harsh words I've said to folks.
I'll work on some stuff too...I'm not the FTBCF police and I never want to be. Then of course the tragedy yesterday, and now I regret the harsh words I've said to folks.
Title: The things I see at work
Post by: beast50 on December 17, 2012, 12:33:27 AM
Post by: beast50 on December 17, 2012, 12:33:27 AM
Quote from: jcassity;404172
another note,,
it use to be, not so long ago, that when a person became of age with a vast amount of experience and they sure as hell knew what they were talking about,,,, everyone else would close thier mouths and open thier ears.... due to sheer respect. couple that with the fact most of these talented people rarely shared what they knew "unless they saw something in you" then they would mentor you.
Now a days, if someone knows stuff, the majority of people have "computer balls" and they bash the people who know stuff.
When i was a couple decades younger we use to call these people the "know it alls" and its my observation that these people who are Type A personality who appear to "know it all", 8 out of 10 of them actually do. So, end result for me was to "put up with the BS" because learning from the know it alls cant be all that bad.
today, 8 out of 10 people dont care to know much of anything because if they did, they might have to work.
Well said!!